Friday, August 31, 2007

Re: [papercreters] Re: Sawcrete

Got another question for you folks, a bit off topic as it doesn't involve paper, but....Can you put plastic bottles (milk, laundry detergent, juice types) through a wood chipper?
 
Pepper
 
----- Original Message -----
From: slurryguy
Sent: Friday, August 31, 2007 5:31 PM
Subject: [papercreters] Re: Sawcrete

Great post Pat. Yes I read it all, and you left me still hungry for
more info. Well done. Please keep us posted.

I think with my long diatribes putting everyone to sleep, an
occasional long post from you will be a breath of fresh air to
everyone. Keep it up. :) hehehe

I'm sure that I used cement in my sample. I can't recall if I would
have used clay, flyash, and/or sand. I would have had all those
ingredients on hand at the time I did it (several years ago). Your
use of lime make sense to me. It ought to make the mix more sticky
and "gluey" helping the slurry hold together better. I doubt I would
have had any lime in my samples.

I find myself wondering about taking waste cedar from old fences or
whatnot and chopping/grinding it up. It might make a fantastic
plaster for the inside of closets. A budget cedar closet! Should
smell great too.

--- In papercreters@yahoogroups.com, "Pat" <trax78245@...> wrote:
>
> The samples I've made so far I've been impressed with..they're just
> sawdust/chips, lime, & clay. I want to experiment some more and
add some
> latex paint to make the color of the mix a little lighter. The
clay I have
> is almost black and it makes the blocks very dark.kindof an icky
gray. It
> probably won't matter what color the mix is because I'm going to
plaster
> over it with a lime-base plaster anyway but I'm thinking the paint
will make
> it a little smoother and easier to pump into the slip forms.
>
>
>
> I keep thinking of the TONS of mix I'll have to make and the time
it'll take
> for each mix.I'm wondering if a cement company would rent a cement
truck out
> by the day or the week. Have the forms ready on *everything* you
want to
> build and pour one lift at a time on everything.wait until the next
weekend
> and pour another lift. Hmmm..maybe I'll call around and see if I
can rent a
> cement truck. It'd save time mixing batches and it seems from what
little
> bit I've been playing with papercrete and sawcrete that it takes the
> sawcrete a little longer to set up and dry out. Maybe it would set
up
> faster if I put some Portland in it? Or would that make it
crumbly? Maybe
> the book I got from Charmaine awhile back about lime will tell
me.or the
> next few bucks I get I'll order her CD.I tell ya', Charmaine is a
handy lady
> to have around when somebody has a question about stuff. Chances
are if she
> doesn't know she knows where we can find out. ;)
>
>
>
> I got the same result you did when I used just Portland, a little
sand, and
> the wood chips/sawdust. But it seems like the lime and clay make a
BIG
> difference. Maybe I can use the lime, Portland, and clay instead of
> sand..I'll have to check it out when it cools off a bit. Or,
instead of
> trying to reinvent the wheel, I could get Charmain's CD. ;)
>
>
>
> I'm really kindf thinking "out loud" and if anybody has to add,
chime in! ;)
>
>
>
> A half bucket of pulped paper huh? Hmmm..probably could pulp a
bucket of
> paper with an old saw blade attached to a long drill bit on a heavy-
duty
> drill? I'll have to go back into the archives to see what-all is
used to
> make a small mixer.
>
>
>
> I'll let cha' know when what happens.but it won't be anytime
soon.it doesn't
> usually cool off here until sometime in the middle of October or
> November.but then, I'm usually still picking tomatoes out of the
garden at
> Christmas. ;) That reminds me. I've been meaning to post the plans
for the
> aviary/greenhouse/guest cottage and get some feedback from folks.
I'll try
> to do that this afternoon.
>
>
>
> If you've made it this far through this ramble, you patience is
amazing and
> greatly appreciated. ;)
>
>
>
> Pat
>
>
>
> _____
>
> From: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:papercreters@yahoogroups.com] On
> Behalf Of slurryguy
> Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 6:47 PM
> To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [papercreters] Sawcrete -was- Re: What are you building
with
> Papercrete?
>
>
>
> Subtle? Subtle? Where's my dictionary. I gotta look that one up!
> hehehe
>
> It makes sense to use what you've got.
>
> In the multitudes of experiments I've run with sawdust (TWO WHOLE
> MINI SAMPLES! hehe), My preliminary discoveries indicated it's not
as
> strong as papercrete. Crumbly. That sample size is hardly
> conclusive on anything. I may not have had the ideal mix ratio for
> sawcrete. I'd guess that the sawdust particle size can make a
> difference too. I did it so long ago I don't even remember what I
> did. It was an off the cuff experiment and I didn't write down the
> details. The second sample was a mix of sawdust and paper and it
> performed drastically better.
>
> My very subjective guess tells me that adding even a half bucket of
> pulped paper to a concrete mixer full of sawdust could make a
> dramatic difference. Food for thought.
>
> You almost certainly have way more experience working with sawcrete
> than I do. You probably have a much better idea what mix to use and
> where to use it. Please educate all of us!
>
> --- In papercreters@ <mailto:papercreters%40yahoogroups.com>
> yahoogroups.com, "Pat" <trax78245@> wrote:
> >
> > SG, you're so subtle with your hints ;)
> >
> >
> >
> > Ok, I have to admit that I'm going to cheat a bit...I'm not going
> to use
> > paper..but the methods of papercrete and the recipes are
basically
> the same.
> > I have an endless, FREE, source of wood chips/sawdust. Using the
> wood
> > chips/sawdust I won't have to have a fancy mixer..just a good HF
> cement
> > mixer. So maybe it's not what I'm building with papercrete, it's
> what I'm
> > building with fibercrete.
> >
> >
> >
> > In order, plans are for:
> >
> >
> >
> > 1) Build a 6' x 6' x 6' high dog house (I have BIG dogs) ;)
> using
> > slip-form with rock facing so it looks like a rock dog house.
> >
> > 2) Encasing my husband's work shop (it's a 40' shipping
> container)
> > using slip forms
> >
> > 3) Build a new aviary and greenhouse
> >
> > 4) Build an extra bedroom & new kitchen onto the mobile home
> >
> > 5) Encase the whole MH with the mix, using the Larsen-truss
> system
> > (Thank you Charmaine!!) and slip-form with rock facing
> >
> > 6) Build raised beds using slip form & rock facing
> >
> >
> >
> > There's SO much more I want to do..but all of it has to wait
until
> it cools
> > off!! This area has really been lucky this year..the temps
haven't
> gone
> > over 100 once this year.for the first time since I moved here
from
> West
> > Texas some 20-odd years ago.but it's still too hot for a fat old
> woman to
> > get out in the heat & humidity and work with lime and cement. ;)
> >
>


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RE: [papercreters] fearless leader

Just listened to the podcast…what a great interview!  You both sounded intelligent with thoughtful questions and insightful answers.  Makes me all fired up about papercrete again!  Maybe I’ll do paper sawcrete. ;)  Great job guys!!!

 


From: papercreters@yahoogroups.com [mailto:papercreters@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Mikey Sklar
Sent: Friday, August 31, 2007 6:49 PM
To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [papercreters] fearless leader

 

Slurryguy agreed to let me do a audio interview with him yesterday
about the papercreters group and PC in general. You can download the
podcast from here:

http://holyscrap.mypodcast.com/

-Mikey

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[papercreters] Re: fearless leader

Fearless? Fearless?

That guy sure seems scarey to me! YIKES!

I hope you'll continue with more interviews Mikey. There must be
better people than that goofball you started with.

Mike McCain?
Eric Patterson?
Spaceman?
Robert Merrill?
Nolan Scheid?
Lloyd Turner?


--- In papercreters@yahoogroups.com, Mikey Sklar <sklarm-yahoo@...>
wrote:
>
> Slurryguy agreed to let me do a audio interview with him yesterday
> about the papercreters group and PC in general. You can download the
> podcast from here:
>
> http://holyscrap.mypodcast.com/
>
> -Mikey
>



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[papercreters] Floor plan uploaded

 

A copy of the floor plan with some explanations has been uploaded into the group photo section in the folder titled “Pat’s Stuff”.  In order to read any of the explanations you’ll have to click on “large” in the space just above the upper top, left-hand corner.

 

This is the *planned* guest cottage with aviary & greenhouse.  I figured instead of building three separate buildings I’d just put them all under one roof.  Saves on digging through rock & clay to lay water lines & electric lines to three different buildings.

 

Comments & criticisms are welcome.

 

Pat   

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[papercreters] fearless leader

Slurryguy agreed to let me do a audio interview with him yesterday
about the papercreters group and PC in general. You can download the
podcast from here:

http://holyscrap.mypodcast.com/

-Mikey



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[papercreters] Re: Sawcrete

Great post Pat. Yes I read it all, and you left me still hungry for
more info. Well done. Please keep us posted.

I think with my long diatribes putting everyone to sleep, an
occasional long post from you will be a breath of fresh air to
everyone. Keep it up. :) hehehe

I'm sure that I used cement in my sample. I can't recall if I would
have used clay, flyash, and/or sand. I would have had all those
ingredients on hand at the time I did it (several years ago). Your
use of lime make sense to me. It ought to make the mix more sticky
and "gluey" helping the slurry hold together better. I doubt I would
have had any lime in my samples.

I find myself wondering about taking waste cedar from old fences or
whatnot and chopping/grinding it up. It might make a fantastic
plaster for the inside of closets. A budget cedar closet! Should
smell great too.


--- In papercreters@yahoogroups.com, "Pat" <trax78245@...> wrote:
>
> The samples I've made so far I've been impressed with..they're just
> sawdust/chips, lime, & clay. I want to experiment some more and
add some
> latex paint to make the color of the mix a little lighter. The
clay I have
> is almost black and it makes the blocks very dark.kindof an icky
gray. It
> probably won't matter what color the mix is because I'm going to
plaster
> over it with a lime-base plaster anyway but I'm thinking the paint
will make
> it a little smoother and easier to pump into the slip forms.
>
>
>
> I keep thinking of the TONS of mix I'll have to make and the time
it'll take
> for each mix.I'm wondering if a cement company would rent a cement
truck out
> by the day or the week. Have the forms ready on *everything* you
want to
> build and pour one lift at a time on everything.wait until the next
weekend
> and pour another lift. Hmmm..maybe I'll call around and see if I
can rent a
> cement truck. It'd save time mixing batches and it seems from what
little
> bit I've been playing with papercrete and sawcrete that it takes the
> sawcrete a little longer to set up and dry out. Maybe it would set
up
> faster if I put some Portland in it? Or would that make it
crumbly? Maybe
> the book I got from Charmaine awhile back about lime will tell
me.or the
> next few bucks I get I'll order her CD.I tell ya', Charmaine is a
handy lady
> to have around when somebody has a question about stuff. Chances
are if she
> doesn't know she knows where we can find out. ;)
>
>
>
> I got the same result you did when I used just Portland, a little
sand, and
> the wood chips/sawdust. But it seems like the lime and clay make a
BIG
> difference. Maybe I can use the lime, Portland, and clay instead of
> sand..I'll have to check it out when it cools off a bit. Or,
instead of
> trying to reinvent the wheel, I could get Charmain's CD. ;)
>
>
>
> I'm really kindf thinking "out loud" and if anybody has to add,
chime in! ;)
>
>
>
> A half bucket of pulped paper huh? Hmmm..probably could pulp a
bucket of
> paper with an old saw blade attached to a long drill bit on a heavy-
duty
> drill? I'll have to go back into the archives to see what-all is
used to
> make a small mixer.
>
>
>
> I'll let cha' know when what happens.but it won't be anytime
soon.it doesn't
> usually cool off here until sometime in the middle of October or
> November.but then, I'm usually still picking tomatoes out of the
garden at
> Christmas. ;) That reminds me. I've been meaning to post the plans
for the
> aviary/greenhouse/guest cottage and get some feedback from folks.
I'll try
> to do that this afternoon.
>
>
>
> If you've made it this far through this ramble, you patience is
amazing and
> greatly appreciated. ;)
>
>
>
> Pat
>
>
>
> _____
>
> From: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:papercreters@yahoogroups.com] On
> Behalf Of slurryguy
> Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 6:47 PM
> To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [papercreters] Sawcrete -was- Re: What are you building
with
> Papercrete?
>
>
>
> Subtle? Subtle? Where's my dictionary. I gotta look that one up!
> hehehe
>
> It makes sense to use what you've got.
>
> In the multitudes of experiments I've run with sawdust (TWO WHOLE
> MINI SAMPLES! hehe), My preliminary discoveries indicated it's not
as
> strong as papercrete. Crumbly. That sample size is hardly
> conclusive on anything. I may not have had the ideal mix ratio for
> sawcrete. I'd guess that the sawdust particle size can make a
> difference too. I did it so long ago I don't even remember what I
> did. It was an off the cuff experiment and I didn't write down the
> details. The second sample was a mix of sawdust and paper and it
> performed drastically better.
>
> My very subjective guess tells me that adding even a half bucket of
> pulped paper to a concrete mixer full of sawdust could make a
> dramatic difference. Food for thought.
>
> You almost certainly have way more experience working with sawcrete
> than I do. You probably have a much better idea what mix to use and
> where to use it. Please educate all of us!
>
> --- In papercreters@ <mailto:papercreters%40yahoogroups.com>
> yahoogroups.com, "Pat" <trax78245@> wrote:
> >
> > SG, you're so subtle with your hints ;)
> >
> >
> >
> > Ok, I have to admit that I'm going to cheat a bit...I'm not going
> to use
> > paper..but the methods of papercrete and the recipes are
basically
> the same.
> > I have an endless, FREE, source of wood chips/sawdust. Using the
> wood
> > chips/sawdust I won't have to have a fancy mixer..just a good HF
> cement
> > mixer. So maybe it's not what I'm building with papercrete, it's
> what I'm
> > building with fibercrete.
> >
> >
> >
> > In order, plans are for:
> >
> >
> >
> > 1) Build a 6' x 6' x 6' high dog house (I have BIG dogs) ;)
> using
> > slip-form with rock facing so it looks like a rock dog house.
> >
> > 2) Encasing my husband's work shop (it's a 40' shipping
> container)
> > using slip forms
> >
> > 3) Build a new aviary and greenhouse
> >
> > 4) Build an extra bedroom & new kitchen onto the mobile home
> >
> > 5) Encase the whole MH with the mix, using the Larsen-truss
> system
> > (Thank you Charmaine!!) and slip-form with rock facing
> >
> > 6) Build raised beds using slip form & rock facing
> >
> >
> >
> > There's SO much more I want to do..but all of it has to wait
until
> it cools
> > off!! This area has really been lucky this year..the temps
haven't
> gone
> > over 100 once this year.for the first time since I moved here
from
> West
> > Texas some 20-odd years ago.but it's still too hot for a fat old
> woman to
> > get out in the heat & humidity and work with lime and cement. ;)
> >
>



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[papercreters] granite

Granite chunks huh??? Hmmm….hadn’t thought about that.  You know, I’m not *too* far from some granite quarries…. Wonder if they’d let a person pick up pieces from the “waste” pile…I’ll have to check it out. I’ve got a counters that need new tops…granite mosaics…cool!  Let us know when you have the kits! 

 

Thanks,

Pat

 


From: papercreters@yahoogroups.com [mailto:papercreters@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dirtcheapbuilder-Charmaine
Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 1:45 PM
To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [papercreters] Re: sawductcrete & granite

 


On Aug 30, 2007, at 2:07 AM, PAT wrote:

I have an endless, FREE, source of wood chips/sawdust. Using the wood
chips/sawdust I won't have to have a fancy mixer..just a good HF cement
mixer. So maybe it's not what I'm building with papercrete, it's what I'm
building with fibercrete.



VOILA!! this is the magic secret I have shared with people for 9 years... sawdust is already ground up, can have shredded paper added, or NOT, and makes a wonderful healthy free insulating wall filler, block, brick, plaster, etc.
I am converting my entire old horse barn- circa 1910 -made of solid redwood with no insulation, into walls filed with various mixes of sawdustcrete- with just clay- lime and sawdust, I add fibers too, since sawdust is so small. so far I love it. sand is not needed, and keeps it a light, more insulative mix. ( I put all this info receipes and pics on a folder inside the CDs I offers
here is a pic of the cast blocks I made with the same recipe- http://www.dirtcheapbuilder.com/dicd.html

so USE whatcha' got!

the book by Bob LaPorte-" EcoNest" replaces his little Mooseprints booklet, and has stunning pics of whole homes done with the wall infill of chopped straw and clay- with lime plasters, and clay plasters righ over it.

this is similar, but easier, and most people have ore access to sawdust nearby than straw bales anyway. Desert folk have office paper but no straw or wood. so use whatcha' got.

GRANITE
With all the tons of polished granite leftovers I am getting I can make granite windowsills for my entire house, and enough tables, and walkways, and floors, countertops etc to sink the house by weight alone six inches into the ground.. haha.

I am going to be offering granite sill soon, for sale, and other smaller pieces, and Mosaic Kits- enough pieces to make a table top by size..cheap.. just to help others have access to the materials.

Look up the yellow pages in your area, and see who has a FAB shop doing this.. it may be a person, or an off shoot of a plumbing shop, supply store, stone/gravel provider. the leftovers are huge perfect pieces you can cut and use in many ways. Even if they charge you a few bucks to haul it off.. be nice.. that is 'gold' you are getting that will last much longer than wood for building projects!

I got some long pale green heavily veined granite pieces yesterday that is going into a fancy home with an All Asian theme. I can use these long strips as a mantle over the door entry on the work studio or even as the trim board along the front of the porch roof. I would split a long curved pole I found in the woods and tie on with leather strips to the granite. for an artsy look.

There is a perfect circle** cut thru on one end that you can hang a wind chime thru, or other art, like a string of sea shells, /bird feeder, etc.

the perfect circles are drill holes where the dynamite blast holes are cut into the rockwall. This particular granite came from Italy by way of China where they prep granite by the mass ton. interesting business of how the natural granite from deep in India, Brazil or Europe gets yo your kitchen counter!


Charmaine Taylor Publishing
www.dirtcheapbuilder.com www.papercrete.com
PO BOX 375 CUTTEN CA 95534 USA
Tel: 707-441-1632 11-4 PST

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Re: [papercreters] ugly eco home debuts at West Coast Green

Weeeelllll, Dirtcheapbuilder, that house does not appeal to me either, but it does coincide with current minimalist trends in trendy housing. Which is deliberate to try to lure those stylish folks who assume green housing has to look like mud huts built by weird hippies. Try to cut 'em a little slack. Most people don't have the nerve for individuality. Besides, how many "orthodox" houses have round edges and softness? And those simple computer illustrations also appeal to the minimalists. I'm glad to see attempts to bring high-tech types into green efficiency. If we let them have their cake, maybe they'll eat it, too.
 
As for whether people in the future will still want that, of course not...right away, but later. Trends and styles and tastes CHANGE over and over. That's why they're called trends and styles! Think of it as a pendulum that swings from kitchey - like the Victorian dictum that too much is never enough, and the current rage for scrapbooking - to minimalism - like Art Deco in the 20s and 30s and this current push, and back again. So what? Like the song says, everything old is new again.... and again..... and again. And nothing dates a painting, book or movie like an attempt to predict future styles.
 
We subscribe to a slick mag called Dwell that often showcases green building anywhere in the world. We have also explored CEB construction, looked at a straw bale house, and fo course, natural adobe. The key to making a house popular with the public is making it look normal, ordinary, and safe. You don't have to paint your face green to live green.
 
By the way, MY dream house is a recycled warehouse with enormous windows, wood burning stove, and a roof covered with garden - NO LAWN.
 
Pepper
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 10:50 PM
Subject: [papercreters] ugly eco home debuts at West Coast Green

I try to keep up with events to the public that push green build or new products..very commercial some of them , but this is the business side of green that has to exist too since not all ' influenced' by greentech will build a cob house, or recycle a tin can in their life. But they have to buy lightbulbs, or choose paint, and buy homes. so there is hope to have some influence on conservation, wasting less, consuming "better"

http://www.westcoastgreen.com/program/showhouse.php

OK that said the West Coast Green show is in San Francisco in Sept 07 and hosts TV stars : Ed Beagley Living with Ed; Susan Susanka "Not So Big House" author, lots of eco products, and a prefab type house made of SIPS with a living roof called the mkLotus, but I see nothing lotus like about it.

Now take one look at the house illustrations ( poor computer ones) in the URL and I think you will agree how ugly and hi tech 'locker room' it looks. there are no round edges, no softness or eco-cool about it. just techy looking- it looks like "1984 " ( the book & film) come to life if HOUSING was the issue, not politics/freedom.

Is it me? or do all/any/some of you not like this trend in "green" building? These "shelters" no matter how efficient & green they ARE underneath they look MORE like Katrina Evacuee quonset huts than any home I would like. Look at any COB or alternative design, and you see something alive, not this hard edged TIN Army shack.

MAYBE these are the ---- sudden realization-- ugh! !! ----- CITY SLICKER "green" buildings people in high-density areas must have???...
OH !NO! MR. BILL!!! say it isn't so!!?? How can 250 "renowned speakers" and 12,000 attendees who will come to West Coast Green LOVE this design, or will they, like me, hate it? or, are we really being "prepared" to accept this as "good housing" in a future resource -starved nation?
Besides the current streamlined look, the ultra Chic slim to bare nothing colors, skinny furniture, will people in the future STILL want that? will it be a choice? what will all the kitchey home decorating, fabric, and furniture stores do to fight back?

the designer M Kuffman did a great looking, albeit techy cold design I like better a year ago- nice shed style roof, more cabin looking, less icy called the glide house-- see it at the site

Charmaine Taylor Publishing << flouncing off to read more books on privacy invasion, and watch X-Files reruns....trust no one..... I mean it!

www.dirtcheapbuilder.com www.papercrete.com
Books-DVDs-Videos-CDs
Tel: 707-441-1632 12-4 PST


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RE: [papercreters] Sawcrete

The samples I’ve made so far I’ve been impressed with….they’re just sawdust/chips, lime, & clay.  I want to experiment some more and add some latex paint to make the color of the mix a little lighter.  The clay I have is almost black and it makes the blocks very dark…kindof an icky gray.  It probably won’t matter what color the mix is because I’m going to plaster over it with a lime-base plaster anyway but I’m thinking the paint will make it a little smoother and easier to pump into the slip forms.

 

I keep thinking of the TONS of mix I’ll have to make and the time it’ll take for each mix…I’m wondering if a cement company would rent a cement truck out by the day or the week.  Have the forms ready on *everything* you want to build and pour one lift at a time on everything…wait until the next weekend and pour another lift.  Hmmm….maybe I’ll call around and see if I can rent a cement truck.  It’d save time mixing batches and it seems from what little bit I’ve been playing with papercrete and sawcrete that it takes the sawcrete a little longer to set up and dry out.  Maybe it would set up faster if I put some Portland in it?  Or would that make it crumbly?  Maybe the book I got from Charmaine awhile back about lime will tell me…or the next few bucks I get I’ll order her CD…I tell ya’, Charmaine is a handy lady to have around when somebody has a question about stuff.  Chances are if she doesn’t know she knows where we can find out. ;)

 

I got the same result you did when I used just Portland, a little sand, and the wood chips/sawdust. But it seems like the lime and clay make a BIG difference.  Maybe I can use the lime, Portland, and clay instead of sand….I’ll have to check it out when it cools off a bit.  Or, instead of trying to reinvent the wheel, I could get Charmain’s CD. ;)

 

I’m really kindf thinking “out loud” and if anybody has to add, chime in! ;)

 

A half bucket of pulped paper huh?  Hmmm….probably could pulp a bucket of paper with an old saw blade attached to a long drill bit on a heavy-duty drill?  I’ll have to go back into the archives to see what-all is used to make a small mixer.

 

I’ll let cha’ know when what happens…but it won’t be anytime soon…it doesn’t usually cool off here until sometime in the middle of October or November…but then, I’m usually still picking tomatoes out of the garden at Christmas. ;)  That reminds me… I’ve been meaning to post the plans for the aviary/greenhouse/guest cottage and get some feedback from folks.  I’ll try to do that this afternoon.

 

If you’ve made it this far through this ramble, you patience is amazing and greatly appreciated. ;)

 

Pat

 


From: papercreters@yahoogroups.com [mailto:papercreters@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of slurryguy
Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 6:47 PM
To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [papercreters] Sawcrete -was- Re: What are you building with Papercrete?

 

Subtle? Subtle? Where's my dictionary. I gotta look that one up!
hehehe

It makes sense to use what you've got.

In the multitudes of experiments I've run with sawdust (TWO WHOLE
MINI SAMPLES! hehe), My preliminary discoveries indicated it's not as
strong as papercrete. Crumbly. That sample size is hardly
conclusive on anything. I may not have had the ideal mix ratio for
sawcrete. I'd guess that the sawdust particle size can make a
difference too. I did it so long ago I don't even remember what I
did. It was an off the cuff experiment and I didn't write down the
details. The second sample was a mix of sawdust and paper and it
performed drastically better.

My very subjective guess tells me that adding even a half bucket of
pulped paper to a concrete mixer full of sawdust could make a
dramatic difference. Food for thought.

You almost certainly have way more experience working with sawcrete
than I do. You probably have a much better idea what mix to use and
where to use it. Please educate all of us!

--- In papercreters@yahoogroups.com, "Pat" <trax78245@...> wrote:
>
> SG, you're so subtle with your hints ;)
>
>
>
> Ok, I have to admit that I'm going to cheat a bit...I'm not going
to use
> paper..but the methods of papercrete and the recipes are basically
the same.
> I have an endless, FREE, source of wood chips/sawdust. Using the
wood
> chips/sawdust I won't have to have a fancy mixer..just a good HF
cement
> mixer. So maybe it's not what I'm building with papercrete, it's
what I'm
> building with fibercrete.
>
>
>
> In order, plans are for:
>
>
>
> 1) Build a 6' x 6' x 6' high dog house (I have BIG dogs) ;)
using
> slip-form with rock facing so it looks like a rock dog house.
>
> 2) Encasing my husband's work shop (it's a 40' shipping
container)
> using slip forms
>
> 3) Build a new aviary and greenhouse
>
> 4) Build an extra bedroom & new kitchen onto the mobile home
>
> 5) Encase the whole MH with the mix, using the Larsen-truss
system
> (Thank you Charmaine!!) and slip-form with rock facing
>
> 6) Build raised beds using slip form & rock facing
>
>
>
> There's SO much more I want to do..but all of it has to wait until
it cools
> off!! This area has really been lucky this year..the temps haven't
gone
> over 100 once this year.for the first time since I moved here from
West
> Texas some 20-odd years ago.but it's still too hot for a fat old
woman to
> get out in the heat & humidity and work with lime and cement. ;)
>

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[papercreters] Sawcrete

Look in the lower right hand corner next to PDF.
click the button that says View/Open OR

http://tinyurl.com/2q5wol

-R. M. Royce


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Re: [papercreters] Sawcrete

Okay, color me stupid, but I can't find any way into the thesis, only its "pedigree". Every link I tried brought me back to http://ir.library.oregonstate.edu/dspace/handle/1957/2187. Since it's dated 1947, I'd really like to read it!
 
Pepper
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Mark Royce
Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 2:15 PM
Subject: [papercreters] Sawcrete


Might check this for formulas for sawcrete.

http://ir.library.oregonstate.edu/dspace/handle/1957/2187

http://tinyurl.com/39vlxe

-R. M. Royce

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Re: [papercreters] Hanging Dome -was- Rocky, Wooded Slope

Wooo, cut off the address after "house" for a full article and lots more pictures!
Pepper 
----- Original Message -----
From: Spaceman
Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 3:30 PM
Subject: Re: [papercreters] Hanging Dome -was- Rocky, Wooded Slope
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Re: [papercreters] Dogs

What a cross!  Great name!
 
ElfN
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Spaceman
He's poodle/terrier mix, therefore Perrier   : P

When he was younger he thought chunks of papercrete made great chew toys. I tried to discourage that since I doubt that portland cement is good for the digestive system.

Spaceman

ElfNori wrote:
 
CUTE dog!
 
ElfN
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Re: [papercreters] Dogs

He's poodle/terrier mix, therefore Perrier   : P

When he was younger he thought chunks of papercrete made great chew toys. I tried to discourage that since I doubt that portland cement is good for the digestive system.

Spaceman

ElfNori wrote:

CUTE dog!
 
ElfN
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Spaceman
Subject: Re: [papercreters] Dogs

http://www.nurl.us/73n

pepperh wrote:

.

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Re: [papercreters] Dogs

CUTE dog!
 
ElfN
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Spaceman
Subject: Re: [papercreters] Dogs

http://www.nurl.us/73n

pepperh wrote:

.

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Re: [papercreters] Dogs

http://www.nurl.us/73n

pepperh wrote:

Whatsa matter, Spaceman? Ashamed of your dog? Somebody set up a photo album and we'll all post our dogs. Hobo's ready.
 
Pepper
 
----- Original Message -----
From: slurryguy
Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 5:13 PM
Subject: [papercreters] Small dome and Dog dome -was- Re: What are you building with Papercrete?

LOL. Why? Cause I like dogs.

What? You think I'm conducting a high tech scientific investigation to
determine if people tend to natrually morph their appearance to match
that of their dog?

I'd never conduct such a study. It would insult every dog I've ever
owned!

Spaceman wrote:

No, not on my website. I'll send you one, but why? Because the doggie
dome will be 6' diameter? He's not that big, but I want him to have
lots of room.

Spaceman


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Re: [papercreters] ugly eco home debuts at West Coast Green

OMG!  It looks like a spiffed up mobile home!  Ugh!
 
I have Susan Susanka's "Not So Big House"  What a waste of print that was.
 
Nori
----- Original Message -----
Subject: [papercreters] ugly eco home debuts at West Coast Green

http://www.westcoastgreen.com/program/showhouse.php

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[papercreters] Next Papercrete Building Code Chat: Saturday, Sept 1, 4 pm ET

The next Papercrete Code Team online chat will be held tomorrow.

We'd truely love to have more people contributing to our efforts.
Everyone is welcome to attend the chats. The best way to be certain
that your ideas and interests are represented is to join in the chats.

Saturday, September 1, 4pm ET,
On Yahoo Messenger.
To download Yahoo Messenger for free please visit:
http://www.messenger.yahoo.com

POST A REPLY TO THIS MESSAGE TO GET INVITED TO THE CHAT.

Be sure to be logged on to Yahoo Messenger Saturday afternoon.
It's typical for one or two of us to show up an hour early just to
chew the fat and have fun.

--- In papercreters@yahoogroups.com, "slurryguy" <slurryguy@...>
wrote:
>
> The Papercrete Code Team will be holding a live online chat
> conference. We hope that we'll be able to get ourselves organized
> more easily this way.
>
> Saturday, August 18, 11am ET,
> On Yahoo Messenger.
> To download Yahoo Messenger for free visit
> http://messenger.yahoo.com
>
> POST A REPLY TO THIS MESSAGE TO GET INVITED TO THE CHAT.
>
> Everyone is welcome to attend and contribute.
>
>
>
> The format of this chat will be informal. While we want to
> accomplish some things, we'll try to have fun while doing it.
>
> No boring minutes. No Robert's Rules of Order. Just a group of
> friends discussing what they want to accomplish and how to do it.
> I'm confident more than one joke will be made at my expense. :)
> That by itself is reason enough to attend. hehehe
>



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Thursday, August 30, 2007

[papercreters] ugly eco home debuts at West Coast Green

I try to keep up with events to the public that push green build or new
products..very commercial some of them , but this is the business side
of green that has to exist too since not all ' influenced' by
greentech will build a cob house, or recycle a tin can in their life.
But they have to buy lightbulbs, or choose paint, and buy homes. so
there is hope to have some influence on conservation, wasting less,
consuming "better"

http://www.westcoastgreen.com/program/showhouse.php

OK that said the West Coast Green show is in San Francisco in Sept
07 and hosts TV stars : Ed Beagley Living with Ed; Susan Susanka
"Not So Big House" author, lots of eco products, and a prefab type
house made of SIPS with a living roof called the mkLotus, but I see
nothing lotus like about it.

Now take one look at the house illustrations ( poor computer ones)
in the URL and I think you will agree how ugly and hi tech 'locker
room' it looks. there are no round edges, no softness or eco-cool
about it. just techy looking- it looks like "1984 " ( the book & film)
come to life if HOUSING was the issue, not politics/freedom.

Is it me? or do all/any/some of you not like this trend in "green"
building? These "shelters" no matter how efficient & green they ARE
underneath they look MORE like Katrina Evacuee quonset huts than any
home I would like. Look at any COB or alternative design, and you see
something alive, not this hard edged TIN Army shack.

MAYBE these are the ---- sudden realization-- ugh! !! ----- CITY
SLICKER "green" buildings people in high-density areas must have???...
OH !NO! MR. BILL!!! say it isn't so!!?? How can 250 "renowned
speakers" and 12,000 attendees who will come to West Coast Green LOVE
this design, or will they, like me, hate it? or, are we really being
"prepared" to accept this as "good housing" in a future resource
-starved nation?
Besides the current streamlined look, the ultra Chic slim to bare
nothing colors, skinny furniture, will people in the future STILL want
that? will it be a choice? what will all the kitchey home decorating,
fabric, and furniture stores do to fight back?

the designer M Kuffman did a great looking, albeit techy cold design I
like better a year ago- nice shed style roof, more cabin looking, less
icy called the glide house-- see it at the site

Charmaine Taylor Publishing << flouncing off to read more books on
privacy invasion, and watch X-Files reruns....trust no one..... I mean
it!

www.dirtcheapbuilder.com

www.papercrete.com
Books-DVDs-Videos-CDs
Tel: 707-441-1632 12-4 PST

Re: [papercreters] Small dome and Dog dome -was- Re: What are you building with Papercrete?

Whatsa matter, Spaceman? Ashamed of your dog? Somebody set up a photo album and we'll all post our dogs. Hobo's ready.
 
Pepper
 
----- Original Message -----
From: slurryguy
Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 5:13 PM
Subject: [papercreters] Small dome and Dog dome -was- Re: What are you building with Papercrete?

LOL. Why? Cause I like dogs.

What? You think I'm conducting a high tech scientific investigation to
determine if people tend to natrually morph their appearance to match
that of their dog?

I'd never conduct such a study. It would insult every dog I've ever
owned!

Spaceman wrote:

No, not on my website. I'll send you one, but why? Because the doggie
dome will be 6' diameter? He's not that big, but I want him to have
lots of room.

Spaceman


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Re: [papercreters] Re: sawductcrete & granite

Add some PC to the mix. If you use a very fine PC mix and add rough stuff like confetti shredded paper to the sawdust  or what ever you have on hand mix, it makes for a really strong block. My blocks made with Cotton Gin trash and papercrete is stronger than regular PC by itself and it shrinks less. I use a 50/50 mix of PC to the Gin Trash and about 8-10 pounds (2.5 gallon bucket mostly full) of Ordinary Portland Cement (OPC)

Dirtcheapbuilder-Charmaine <tms@northcoast.com> wrote:


On Aug 30, 2007, at 2:07 AM, PAT wrote:

I have an endless, FREE, source of wood chips/sawdust. Using the wood
chips/sawdust I won't have to have a fancy mixer..just a good HF cement
mixer. So maybe it's not what I'm building with papercrete, it's what
I'm
building with fibercrete.



VOILA!! this is the magic secret I have shared with people for 9
years... sawdust is already ground up, can have shredded paper added,
or NOT, and makes a wonderful healthy free insulating wall filler,
block, brick, plaster, etc.
I am converting my entire old horse barn- circa 1910 -made of solid
redwood with no insulation, into walls filed with various mixes of
sawdustcrete- with just clay- lime and sawdust, I add fibers too,
since sawdust is so small. so far I love it. sand is not needed, and
keeps it a light, more insulative mix. ( I put all this info receipes
and pics on a folder inside the CDs I offers
here is a pic of the cast blocks I made with the same recipe-
http://www.dirtcheapbuilder.com/dicd.html

so USE whatcha' got!

the book by Bob LaPorte-" EcoNest" replaces his little Mooseprints
booklet, and has stunning pics of whole homes done with the wall
infill of chopped straw and clay- with lime plasters, and clay
plasters righ over it.

this is similar, but easier, and most people have ore access to
sawdust nearby than straw bales anyway. Desert folk have office
paper but no straw or wood. so use whatcha' got.

GRANITE
With all the tons of polished granite leftovers I am getting I can
make granite windowsills for my entire house, and enough tables, and
walkways, and floors, countertops etc to sink the house by weight alone
six inches into the ground.. haha.

I am going to be offering granite sill soon, for sale, and other
smaller pieces, and Mosaic Kits- enough pieces to make a table top by
size..cheap.. just to help others have access to the materials.

Look up the yellow pages in your area, and see who has a FAB shop
doing this.. it may be a person, or an off shoot of a plumbing shop,
supply store, stone/gravel provider. the leftovers are huge perfect
pieces you can cut and use in many ways. Even if they charge you a few
bucks to haul it off.. be nice.. that is 'gold' you are getting that
will last much longer than wood for building projects!

I got some long pale green heavily veined granite pieces yesterday
that is going into a fancy home with an All Asian theme. I can use
these long strips as a mantle over the door entry on the work
studio or even as the trim board along the front of the porch roof.
I would split a long curved pole I found in the woods and tie on with
leather strips to the granite. for an artsy look.

There is a perfect circle** cut thru on one end that you can hang a
wind chime thru, or other art, like a string of sea shells, /bird
feeder, etc.

the perfect circles are drill holes where the dynamite blast holes are
cut into the rockwall. This particular granite came from Italy by way
of China where they prep granite by the mass ton. interesting business
of how the natural granite from deep in India, Brazil or Europe gets
yo your kitchen counter!


Charmaine Taylor Publishing
www.dirtcheapbuilder.com www.papercrete.com
PO BOX 375 CUTTEN CA 95534 USA
Tel: 707-441-1632 11-4 PST


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[papercreters] Small dome and Dog dome -was- Re: What are you building with Papercrete?

LOL. Why? Cause I like dogs.

What? You think I'm conducting a high tech scientific investigation to
determine if people tend to natrually morph their appearance to match
that of their dog?

I'd never conduct such a study. It would insult every dog I've ever
owned!

Spaceman wrote:

No, not on my website. I'll send you one, but why? Because the doggie
dome will be 6' diameter? He's not that big, but I want him to have
lots of room.

Spaceman



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