[papercreters] Re: Wild Harvested Binders and Fiberous Plant Matter

I'm glad to see that you are experimenting.

I know that several people have worked with various forms of spraying papercrete, but most have limited themselves to spraying a thin papercrete stucco or plaster coating. It might be possible to very gradually build up a thickness using these techniques if someone were willing to spray a 1/4 in layer or so, then WAIT WAIT WAIT. Protect the papercrete from the weather and allow it to dry COMPLETELY. Then spray another 1/4" or so layer, and wait all over again.

Repeat, repeat, repeat, etc.

I don't consider this technique practical. It would take forever to build up any structural thickness.

I'm sorry to report that I haven't discovered anything that I would consider a practical mix or a practical system to spray large thicknesses of papercrete.

On the other hand, you mentioned pumping papercrete into forms. THAT is a technique that I believe can work extremely well. It has been done before multiple times. For what it's worth, pumping into forms is the direction I would recommend attempting. I believe you'll have more success.


You mentioned using "flour." Did you simply add raw uncooked ground flour to your papercrete? I don't recall that being attempted before.

I have my doubts about it's effectiveness, especially when one considers the possibility of attracting insects and other hungry critters. However, I find myself wondering what would happen if one started a mix by adding just water and flour to your mixer and agitating that for a long enough time to build up gluten. Gluten is extremely sticky. How well it would maintain that stickyness once more water and paper were added, I don't know.

I find myself also questioning whether a mix that would be sticky enough to glue itself to a wall and stay there would be a mix that would also tend to glue itself to pretty much any spray gun and either clog it or substantially reduce its effectiveness.


I have heard in the past of people using "wheat paste" in plasters. Wheat paste is a mixture of water and flour that is COOKED. As the mixture comes to a boil it will thicken substantially like... well... gravy. I guess technically it is gravy, or at least it is what the French would have called a "Velouté"

This is not something I have experimented with. Mainly because I've never considered putting food inside papercrete as a good idea when considering potential pest problems.

That doesn't mean you should not continue to experiment with whatever you want. Perhaps you'll discover a method to overcome the limitations that I have a difficult time looking beyond.

--- In papercreters@yahoogroups.com, "ken winston caine" <ken.winston.caine@...> wrote:
>
>
> <snip>
>
> Have been doing experiments in the manner Jay suggests here for more than a year now. I have been trying to come up with a fire-safe, non-cement mix that can be pumped into forms and / or sprayed onto burlap and that will result in a hard, durable wall with substantial water resistance.
>
> Have not had great results. Yet.
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> Have found that pulped paper (with borax added for insect, mold and fire-resistance) and water cure to a very firm, well-bonded, super lightweight building block. And if the slurry is made thin enough, it can be pumped or sprayed with my trash pump. (Although it shrinks a lot during cure because it was so thin to start with.) But this was already known here. I didn't discover it. Just repeated it.
>
> What I did find was that adding things like a clay and lime, flour, asphalt emulsion and don't recall what else I've experimented with so far, has resulted in a crumbly cured block and a poor, not sticky enough coating for burlap. The coating mostly washed off in rains. I did not achieve the desired water resistance. (But water resistance CAN be achieved with AE. Spaceman tested that many years ago. And Charmaine has cited it, too. I just didn't use the right combo of ingredients, apparently, so far.)
>
> Am certain that one reason for the crumbliness of my cured blocks -- particularly in regard to the clay-lime mix -- is that I added far too much clay. Will be experimenting with much smaller proportions of clay when I get back to this.
>
> What I don't know -- because I haven't done the Mikey Sklar blow-torch test -- is just how burn resistant are my blocks made of only pulped paper with borax added.
>
> Did find a university study last year on using boric acid for fire resistance in papercrete and their findings were disappointing. Took a massive amount of boric acid to do the trick. Much more than we usually find recommended in the papercrete community.
>
> Still have one of my experimental paper/water/borax blocks around. Jay has reminded me that I need to do the fire-test experiment.
>
> Best,
> kwc
>
> P.S. Update on experimental miniaturized rocket thermal mass heater: Have it working well outdoors. Have a clean, smokeless burn and am drawing off and storing in mass so much heat that I can lay my hand flat on the exhaust pipe and leave it there during the burn. Is pleasantly warm. Does not get HOT. I'd guess the temperature of the gasses and moisture exiting the exhaust are about 120 F. Heater was still radiating substantial heat last night, outdoors in 31 F temperature, three full hours after I shut off the burn. Today is the beginning of the install. (Need to rip out the dinettee and a lot of stuff in the kitchen section of my RV. Not sure how long that is going to take.) Would be nice to have heat indoors tonight. And tomorrow morning. Don't know if I'll get that far today. Feel good about predicting that it will be installed and burning indoors by tomorrow p.m.)
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>



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