Re: [papercreters] Batteries on concrete (was: Re: just wondering)

that still doesn't explain why supposedly even a percentage of MgO in the concrete mix 

prevents the discharge of batteries from occurring?

I thought it might have something to do with whatever the galvanic current thing is

in Ferrocement- where the zincalume reacts electrically with Something in the concrete to the detriment

of structural strength and longevity?

or maybe more wives tales?

On Fri, Apr 5, 2013 at 7:43 AM, prrr.t21@btinternet.com <prrr@talk21.com> wrote:

 

AIUI, sitting on concrete made them cold, causing at times
a) condensation on the case, discharging it
b) condensation in the acid, diluting it and causing it to overflow & again short the battery.

> On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 5:22 PM, liberty1_27606

> <liberty1@...>wrote:it worries me to think of
>
>
>
>
> **

> >
> >
> >
> > Eo,
> >
> > The "batteries on concrete" myth got started in the early days of the
> > automobile - think Model T. At that time, the container parts of batteries
> > were made from wood. The thinking was that the moisture in the case would
> > conduct electricity to the moisture in the concrete and drain the battery.
> > Today, battery cases are made from plastic, so I do not think this is a
> > real problem.
> >
> > (Restorers of brass era cars - I don't know if the original myth was true.)
> >
> > Bobby
> >
> > --- In papercreters@yahoogroups.com, eo greensticks wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > i have been using the ferrocement technique for sculpture and one of the
> > > reasons i was interested in MgO was the different electrical
> > > characteristics of the MgOPO4 concrete...
> > >
> > > the 'flaw' in ferrocement is that if you are using chickenwire with
> > > galvanized coating (zinc)
> > > i understand that there is an electrical interaction in between the zinc
> > > and the portland concrete which will eventually deteriorate the
> > > sculpture.Portland and copper don't get along either apparently.
> > >
> > > maybe the MgOPO4 over the chicken wire Might eliminate this problem, does
> > > anyone know?
> > >
> > > what i thought was to then use the papercrete as the *top* layer (the
> > other
> > > way around to the suggestion)- it would absorb water of course
> > > (small test piece indicates that it absorbs an approximate third of its
> > > weight in water-hopefully not too much for the engineering of the frame?)
> > > but the water would then be released back into the atmosphere from that
> > top
> > > layer - Would that work?
> > >
> > > I would *rather* use the MgOPO4 in the papercrete so that it was
> > > 'everything proof' ( all fibre encased in chemically bonded ceramic
> > sounds
> > > great!) but
> > > i am still trying to find a source of the raw ingredients at an
> > affordable
> > > price-
> > > it seems that the Granicrete is fairly expensive as well-i would be using
> > > it to test if i could get any
> > > but no australian supplier yet.
> > >
> > > i read Somewhere that even a small percentage of MgO in concrete mix for
> > a
> > > slab means that a
> > > battery left overnight on the slab will not be discharged (i did not
> > know a
> > > battery left on a concrete slab overnight Would be discharged but there
> > you
> > > go)
> > >
> > > I have tried using MgO, the reactive kind with the cow on the bag, in the
> > > portland mix for ferrocement over galv chicken wire at 2 parts (by
> > > volume!) MgO to 1 part Portland and also the other was around (2 parts
> > > portland to 1 part MgO, by volume again) but hard to say what the
> > > difference is and i will not be here in 500 years to know if it failed!
> > So
> > > far, after 2 years it seems fine...
> > >
> > > This would Not , of course, be the chemically bonded ceramic that seems
> > to
> > > have become my 'holy grail' but i was going on the formula reccommended
> > by
> > > TecEco to the sculptor in west australia who made the beautiful giant
> > > Ghekko sculpture (i think he also used flyash and
> > > clinoptilolite in his formula though which i did not)
> > >
> > > I am starting a new sculpture now, having just completed the chickenwire
> > > armature-having failed
> > > to find a source of the dead burned MgO i will use portland but thinking
> > > about coating the wire with something to isolate it from the portland-i
> > may
> > > use reactive MgO in the portland mix for what it's worth but as i said,
> > do
> > > not know if that will mitigate the 'electrical' deterioration of the
> > > material.
> > >
> > > Does anyone have any ideas about this?
> > >
> > > PS: at the risk of being longwinded (!) i attended a wooden Boat Festival
> > > yesterday where they
> > >
> > > were making boats with heat shrinkable dacron over cane or wood
> > > frames-very lightweight-
> > >
> > > brought me back to thinking about the patio roof i have been ruminating
> > >
> > > on for some time- my latest idea had been a lightweight sapling frame
> > with
> > > rope or wire (or
> > >
> > > cane?) between the larger woods (which turned out to be exactly how they
> > do
> > > the boats!)
> > >
> > > i would then 'skin' this frame (like the boats) with cloth stretched
> > > tight onto it and then paint
> > >
> > > with bondcrete -this would become the interior surface-and would provide
> > a
> > > stiff enough
> > >
> > > support capable of holding the weight of a second layer of cloth dipped
> > in
> > >
> > > slurry without any sagging , a design problem which has dogged my
> > previous
> > > efforts at 'roof'
> > >
> > > (oh, for the MgOPO4-but i would use PC for availability just to get it
> > > done and keep the
> > >
> > > patio from being washed away by these crazy rains!)
> > >
> > > The idea is that i could work in courses from the edge to the top so that
> > > each completed
> > >
> > > section would hold my weight to continue the process (i would probably
> > use
> > > removable supports
> > >
> > > to be on the safe side...) resulting , if it works, in a curving organic
> > > sort of roof shaped so as to
> > >
> > > shed the water to where i can collect it ..
> > >
> > > I go around about whether it should then be rendered over or perhaps a
> > > renderish layer
> > >
> > > of..papercrete? sawdustcrete? something...?* between* the cloth layers-
> > > maybe not necessary
> > >
> > > for strength but better for some insulation (my unlined tin roofs 'rain'
> > > inside from condensation on
> > >
> > > cold mornings, not good!)and then some kind of waterproofing safe for
> > water
> > > collection over the
> > >
> > > top.
> > >
> > > Obviously the MgOPO4 is still the perfect but so far unobtainable
> > solution
> > > to this design
> > >
> > > possibility but from what i have done so far and what i saw at the boat
> > > festival, i think it may
> > >
> > > work.
> > >
> > > there may be some 'tie down' issues to keep the thing
> > >
> > > on site (!) but it had me surmising that an upturned boat may have been
> > > 'the primordial roof'?
> > >
> > > cheers, eo
> > >
> > >
> > > On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 9:45 AM, seniorfinancialplanningins <

> > > devonia111@> wrote:
> > >
> > > > **
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > *MgO i*s used as an insulator in industrial cables, as a basic
> > refractory
> > > > material for crucibles and as a principal fireproofing ingredient in
> > > > construction materials.
> > > >
> > > > *From:* Garth & Kim Travis
> > > > *To:* papercreters@yahoogroups.com
> > > > *Sent:* Sunday, February 10, 2013 7:26 AM
> > > > *Subject:* Re: [papercreters] just wondering
> > > > **
> > > >
> > > > Greetings,
> > > > What is MgO?
> > > >
> > > > Bright Blessings,
> > > > Garth & Kim Travis
> > > > http://www.therosecoloredforest.com/
> > > >
> > > > Bedias, Texas
> > > >
> > > > On 2/9/2013 10:59 PM, devonias wrote:
> > > > > I was thinking of you using papercrete on a small chicken wire
> > structure
> > > > > then covering it with MgO...can you shoot MgO from a heavy duty shop
> > vac?
> > > > >
> > > > > _
> > > > ****
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
>

__._,_.___

Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional
Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required)
Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured
Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe

__,_._,___