RE: [papercreters] New Mexico Pumice and Perlite

This is one of the best emails I've received in a long time. Thanks so much for all this information. Do you plan to visit these places soon? We could meet and go together. If not I think I'll call them and see if I can make an appointment for a little tour, or at least drive over and take a look. I've heard that it's visible from the highway therefore easy to find.

Sincerely, Judith
Visit my papercrete website at www.judith-l-williams.com.

"Never be afraid to try something new. Remember, amateurs built the Ark. Professionals, on the other hand, built the Titanic." Author unknown.

---

To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
From: sire@comcast.net
Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2008 03:46:50 -0700
Subject: [papercreters] New Mexico Pumice and Perlite

Hi Judith,

 

I doubt that water would soak into blocks that are a foot above ground and painted with latex.

 

To answer your other questions, pumice is a unique material not found in most places, so you are very lucky to live to so close to a source of it.   Mixed with lime it has been used as an additive to concrete for thousands of years, especially used in Roman times.   The insulative value of lightweight concrete aggregates is much greater than the usual concrete gravel and sand aggregates.   The order of increasing insulation value would go something like pumice, perlite, and vermiculite.   Pumice and perlite are similar being essentially volcanic glass that has been expanded or hydrated.   Since the insulative values of these materials are not that different, cost becomes the predominant factor, so pumice and perlite being in your back yard so to speak would be the materials of choice.

 

Perlite is a form of volcanic glass, like pumice, that when heated expands to many times its size.   The water held in it gives it the characteristic white (or pearl=perlite) color.   This expansion process is not unlike how popcorn is made.

 

I live in Albuquerque.   I didn't realize this before looking into it, but there is a world-class perlite deposit in the No Agua Peaks area in Taos County very near you.   Someday I would like to go up there and poke around, ask questions, find out about the process of mining and expanding it.  New Mexico is the leading state in the production of perlite.

 

The No Agua resource near the Colorado Border is said to be the largest perlite deposit in the world. It hosts two of the State's largest mines, one owned by Harborlite (previous Celite and Johns Manville); the other by Dicaperl (a subsidiary of Grefco, previously General Refractories).   Smaller deposits are near Socorro and Grants.   All of the mines are open-pit, extracting by simple ripping and scraping; only a minor amount of drilling and blasting is required. Dicaperl's processing plant for its No Agua perlite is located on railhead in Antonito, Colorado, 25 miles north of the mine. It produces up to 200,000 short tons per year of sized crude perlite, over one-quarter of total U.S. output. Over 90% is shipped to expanders; 7% is expanded on-site.  The Harborlite mine is adjacent to Dicaperl's. Their ore is also trucked to Antonito for sizing and rail shipment. 

 

New Mexico is also second in the U.S. in pumice production. Six mining operations are known -- 2 each in Santa Fe, Rio Arriba and Sandoval counties.    Some local companies are

Copar Pumice Co. in Espanola, NM, CR Minerals Corp. in Santa Fe, NM; and Utility Block Co., Albuquerque.

 

Neal

   

 

 

----- Original Message -----

From: JUDITH WILLIAMS

To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 12:55 PM

Subject: RE: [papercreters] Water Resistance

Thanks Neal. The last time I went to the pumice plant the guy pulled out a little chart listing and comparing the insulative value of each grade of pumice. It's on that info that I have based my "pumice adds to insulative value of papercrete" theory. I would never put a papercrete wall directly on the ground. I always argue for it being at least 8" above grade and ideally I believe it should be at least a foot. We have huge gully washer downpours here. I noticed after one particularly intense one the about 30% of my pumice pile had been washed away and the water had come up to almost a foot high on the back wall of the building. That wall just happened to have been built only about 4" above grade and got pretty wet. It did dry out quickly but I don't think it would have been very good for it to have gotten that wet if the finish plaster had already been in place. On the new project, a very small studio, I will use a rubble trench foundation with a concrete grade beam reinforced with #4 rebar. The first couple of courses of papercrete blocks will be painted liberally with latex paint then I think I will slip form the walls the rest of the way up. (may need some sort of barrier between the latex painted blocks and the poured slurry or would painting the top of them protect them against water soaking in?) I wonder how much it would cost to ship perlite. Do you live in Texas or NM? I'm in Abiquiu, NM, about 40 miles north of Santa Fe. Does perlite just come out of the ground as is or is it processed somehow? Interesting stuff.

Sincerely, Judith
Visit my papercrete website at www.judith-l-williams.com.

"Never be afraid to try something new. Remember, amateurs built the Ark. Professionals, on the other hand, built the Titanic." Author unknown.

---

To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
From: sire@comcast.net
Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 19:34:24 +0000
Subject: RE: [papercreters] Water Resistance

Judith,

 

Generally from past messages latex paint has far more effectiveness if it is painted on or otherwise present in the outermost layer.

 

The post you are commenting on needs some clarification.   Papercrete requires no foundation?   That is a brand new assertion.   Overhang and drainage does not always keep water away from the wall base.

 

The insulative value is improved with aggregate?   Not if it is rocks, which aggregate usually means.   There is a world of difference between perlite and rocks.   Incidentally I can get a truckload of perlite shipped to anyone from Arizona if they would pay shipping.

 

"Purists insist lime is better"?   Better than what?   Are purists those people who study materials that have been used effectively for thousands of years but have gone out of fashion, and then point out that there are good reasons for them to be used again?

 

Neal

.

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[papercreters] New Mexico Pumice and Perlite

Hi Judith,

 

I doubt that water would soak into blocks that are a foot above ground and painted with latex.

 

To answer your other questions, pumice is a unique material not found in most places, so you are very lucky to live to so close to a source of it.   Mixed with lime it has been used as an additive to concrete for thousands of years, especially used in Roman times.   The insulative value of lightweight concrete aggregates is much greater than the usual concrete gravel and sand aggregates.   The order of increasing insulation value would go something like pumice, perlite, and vermiculite.   Pumice and perlite are similar being essentially volcanic glass that has been expanded or hydrated.   Since the insulative values of these materials are not that different, cost becomes the predominant factor, so pumice and perlite being in your back yard so to speak would be the materials of choice.

 

Perlite is a form of volcanic glass, like pumice, that when heated expands to many times its size.   The water held in it gives it the characteristic white (or pearl=perlite) color.   This expansion process is not unlike how popcorn is made.

 

I live in Albuquerque.   I didn't realize this before looking into it, but there is a world-class perlite deposit in the No Agua Peaks area in Taos County very near you.   Someday I would like to go up there and poke around, ask questions, find out about the process of mining and expanding it.  New Mexico is the leading state in the production of perlite.

 

The No Agua resource near the Colorado Border is said to be the largest perlite deposit in the world. It hosts two of the State's largest mines, one owned by Harborlite (previous Celite and Johns Manville); the other by Dicaperl (a subsidiary of Grefco, previously General Refractories).   Smaller deposits are near Socorro and Grants.   All of the mines are open-pit, extracting by simple ripping and scraping; only a minor amount of drilling and blasting is required. Dicaperl's processing plant for its No Agua perlite is located on railhead in Antonito, Colorado, 25 miles north of the mine. It produces up to 200,000 short tons per year of sized crude perlite, over one-quarter of total U.S. output. Over 90% is shipped to expanders; 7% is expanded on-site.  The Harborlite mine is adjacent to Dicaperl's. Their ore is also trucked to Antonito for sizing and rail shipment. 

 

New Mexico is also second in the U.S. in pumice production. Six mining operations are known -- 2 each in Santa Fe, Rio Arriba and Sandoval counties.    Some local companies are Copar Pumice Co. in Espanola, NM, CR Minerals Corp. in Santa Fe, NM; and Utility Block Co., Albuquerque.

 

Neal

   

 

 

----- Original Message -----

From: JUDITH WILLIAMS

To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 12:55 PM

Subject: RE: [papercreters] Water Resistance

Thanks Neal. The last time I went to the pumice plant the guy pulled out a little chart listing and comparing the insulative value of each grade of pumice. It's on that info that I have based my "pumice adds to insulative value of papercrete" theory. I would never put a papercrete wall directly on the ground. I always argue for it being at least 8" above grade and ideally I believe it should be at least a foot. We have huge gully washer downpours here. I noticed after one particularly intense one the about 30% of my pumice pile had been washed away and the water had come up to almost a foot high on the back wall of the building. That wall just happened to have been built only about 4" above grade and got pretty wet. It did dry out quickly but I don't think it would have been very good for it to have gotten that wet if the finish plaster had already been in place. On the new project, a very small studio, I will use a rubble trench foundation with a concrete grade beam reinforced with #4 rebar. The first couple of courses of papercrete blocks will be painted liberally with latex paint then I think I will slip form the walls the rest of the way up. (may need some sort of barrier between the latex painted blocks and the poured slurry or would painting the top of them protect them against water soaking in?) I wonder how much it would cost to ship perlite. Do you live in Texas or NM? I'm in Abiquiu, NM, about 40 miles north of Santa Fe. Does perlite just come out of the ground as is or is it processed somehow? Interesting stuff.

Sincerely, Judith
Visit my papercrete website at www.judith-l-williams.com.

"Never be afraid to try something new. Remember, amateurs built the Ark. Professionals, on the other hand, built the Titanic." Author unknown.

---

To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
From: sire@comcast.net
Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 19:34:24 +0000
Subject: RE: [papercreters] Water Resistance

Judith,

 

Generally from past messages latex paint has far more effectiveness if it is painted on or otherwise present in the outermost layer.

 

The post you are commenting on needs some clarification.   Papercrete requires no foundation?   That is a brand new assertion.   Overhang and drainage does not always keep water away from the wall base.

 

The insulative value is improved with aggregate?   Not if it is rocks, which aggregate usually means.   There is a world of difference between perlite and rocks.   Incidentally I can get a truckload of perlite shipped to anyone from Arizona if they would pay shipping.

 

"Purists insist lime is better"?   Better than what?   Are purists those people who study materials that have been used effectively for thousands of years but have gone out of fashion, and then point out that there are good reasons for them to be used again?

 

Neal