Friday, September 9, 2011

[papercreters] Re: Trash Pump Intake Hose ideas?



 Spaceman wrote:


 <snip> I would be tempted to mount the pump on the
tongue of the mixer and tie it directly into the bottom of
the tank.

----

Thanks!

That shortens the hose and gets rid of nearly all the bends. And I feel so dense for not having thought of it. And that's why I'm so grateful for input from groups like this! Having multiple minds accessible is better than having only one.

Maybe heavy duty RV sewer hose, reinforced like crazy with a couple rolls of duct tape would be adequate for a super short (maybe 2') section of flexi intake pipe if I need a flex section (on either or both ends of rigid pvc pipe) to get from the tank outlet to the pump inlet?  Or -- if I only need about 4 feet of the semi-rigid hose, then $8 foot is OK. 

NEW QUESTION, SPACEMAN:  Would I burn up the pump if I used 2" hose instead of 3" and adapted it at the connector ends. Or, conversely, would I run into problems if I used 4" hose instead of 3"? (I imagine it might not pump at all, but am new to trash pumps...)

-- ken






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Thursday, September 8, 2011

Re: [papercreters] Trash Pump Intake Hose ideas?



That is an interesting point. I never tried sucking pc more than about five feet, though that worked fine. I first made the mistake of using a canvas fire hose on the output of my 2" pump and found that any little kink caused a blockage that soon became a solid lump of compressed pc from the pressure behind it. I started using some large irrigation tubing with a smooth inside and made sure I did not kink it. That works great and I am able to pump 100' through 2" tube, with a 25' head - to the top of a dome.

I think that it would not be a problem to suck pc fifteen feet or so as long as there are no obstructions or restrictions, but there is only one way to know for sure. It looks like a fairly long suction hose that Mikey used in this video though it is hard to tell from the quick cut.  Ken, I'm curious about why the pump has to be so far away from your mixer and around several corners. I would be tempted to mount the pump on the tongue of the mixer and tie it directly into the bottom of the tank.


spaceman  All opinions expressed or implied are subject to change without notice upon receipt of new information.  

On 9/8/2011 4:58 PM, Trevor Grigson wrote:

Hey Ken,

 

Maybe go scrounging to your local concrete pumping company.  They may have a bit of hose that will do the job. Most likely 4” though.

 

But I doubt you be able to suck slurry very far at all.  Pumping yes, but sucking no...

 

Trev

 

From: papercreters@yahoogroups.com [mailto:papercreters@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ken winston caine
Sent: Friday, 9 September 2011 3:14 AM
To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [papercreters] Trash Pump Intake Hose ideas?

 

 

I've purchased a 3" trash pump for pumping my papercrete slurry and need to come up with a rigid intake hose for it.

I know that for sections of the about 15-foot intake hose that I can use 3" pvc. But it also needs flexible bends.

These need to be strong enough and rigid enough that they will not collapse during significant suction and will not puncture as slurry is pumped through the flexible portions.

Any ideas of inexpensive or reusable discarded materials that (along with hose clamps) could be used to manufacture the flexible portions of the intake hose? Would need to slide over 3" diameter pvc and clamp tightly to it.

Alternately, are you aware of any flexible, semi-rigid hoses or tubing material of 3" diameter that I could scavenge or re-purpose for the entire intake hose? I need the hose to be about 15 feet in length and to make several 90 to 180 degree bends.

Locally, 3-inch diameter semi-rigid intake-hose material made for trash pump (and water pump) use is selling for about $8 per foot.

(The stuff is advertised for 99 cents per foot on eBay, but they make up the difference with outrageous shipping/handling fees. It still comes out to somewhere north of $6 per foot.)

Would like to apply some ingeniuty -- yours and mine -- and beat that price and maybe, in the process, make good re-use of something that otherwise would be clogging a landfill.

Ideas?

Thanks,
ken

 


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RE: [papercreters] Trash Pump Intake Hose ideas?



Hey Ken,

 

Maybe go scrounging to your local concrete pumping company.  They may have a bit of hose that will do the job. Most likely 4” though.

 

But I doubt you be able to suck slurry very far at all.  Pumping yes, but sucking no...

 

Trev

 

From: papercreters@yahoogroups.com [mailto:papercreters@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ken winston caine
Sent: Friday, 9 September 2011 3:14 AM
To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [papercreters] Trash Pump Intake Hose ideas?

 

 

I've purchased a 3" trash pump for pumping my papercrete slurry and need to come up with a rigid intake hose for it.

I know that for sections of the about 15-foot intake hose that I can use 3" pvc. But it also needs flexible bends.

These need to be strong enough and rigid enough that they will not collapse during significant suction and will not puncture as slurry is pumped through the flexible portions.

Any ideas of inexpensive or reusable discarded materials that (along with hose clamps) could be used to manufacture the flexible portions of the intake hose? Would need to slide over 3" diameter pvc and clamp tightly to it.

Alternately, are you aware of any flexible, semi-rigid hoses or tubing material of 3" diameter that I could scavenge or re-purpose for the entire intake hose? I need the hose to be about 15 feet in length and to make several 90 to 180 degree bends.

Locally, 3-inch diameter semi-rigid intake-hose material made for trash pump (and water pump) use is selling for about $8 per foot.

(The stuff is advertised for 99 cents per foot on eBay, but they make up the difference with outrageous shipping/handling fees. It still comes out to somewhere north of $6 per foot.)

Would like to apply some ingeniuty -- yours and mine -- and beat that price and maybe, in the process, make good re-use of something that otherwise would be clogging a landfill.

Ideas?

Thanks,
ken



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Re: [papercreters] Re: Mixer Design



Ken,
Be sure to take out the brakes and remove the springs and hanger brackets.  Also just in case it makes a difference, turn the differential around so you are towing it backwards.  Spaceman says it may last longer, although we haven't gotten a definitive answer on that issue yet.  And lastly be sure to completely fill the differential with oil (after all your welding is done).
Good luck!
Ron


From: ken winston caine <kwc@mindbodyspiritjournal.com>

 
Have been trying to locate a good, inexpensive source for those totes. They are what bulk corn syrup and bulk invert sugar and bulk maple syrup are shipped in to processed-food manufacturers and large-scale candy manufacturers (like Brachs, Stovers, Kraft, etc).

In the east and midwest -- where it appears most of the major candy manufacturers are located -- people report getting the totes for free (as discards) from factories for the asking and I find Craig's List ads back there where people are selling them for $50.

I was able to purchase one here (Santa Fe, New Mexico region) from a private party for $100 and so far have not found an industrial source for them. Would like to get three or four more -- for $50 each or less.

Anyone have any ideas?

And quick update on my own tow-behind mixer plans.

I bought a pickup-truck bed trailer and will be using the rear end and frame and trailer tongue from that for mine. MAY be using some of the pickup truck bed metal, too, for the platform.

Probably won't be building it for about two weeks as I just learned that my local dump transfer station is closing in a week for 60 days for reconstruction. And.... that is from where I was hoping to pull 5 tons of newsprint -- if the manager there is still game to let me. (She was a couple years ago.) So right now, I've shifted priorities to getting my flatbed trailer together to haul newsprint and seeing how much is available to pull from the transfer station before it closes.

For my tow mixer I MAY use one of the cube totes like Doris and Ron did. Or I may find a used usable round stock tank before I get to the building task.

Still not certain how I will attach the truck rear-end to the frame once I remove the leaf springs, but have some ideas.

-- ken

--- In papercreters@yahoogroups.com, michael joyce <mojojoyce@...> wrote:
>
> I am wondering about the same thing as far as I thought I saw a square plastic tank with the metal cage 275 gallon as a mixer.  This is by far  the cheapest tank that I can get around here. Michael
>
> --- On Tue, 8/23/11, Doris Burton <yakishome@...> wrote:
>
> From: Doris Burton <yakishome@...>
> Subject: Re: [papercreters] Mixer Design
> To: "papercreters@yahoogroups.com" <papercreters@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: Tuesday, August 23, 2011, 9:34 PM
>
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> We mixed many batches and never seemed to have had any left in the cube, all paper mixed to an even consistency We did our entire project with it and never had any problems. Oh and it was not a small project.
> Doris
>
>
>
>
> From: Spaceman <Spaceman@...>
> To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
> Sent:
> Tuesday, August 23, 2011 5:13 PM
> Subject: [papercreters] Mixer Design
>
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> I have been having an interesting discussion off list with Ken about
> mixer design.
>
>
>
> I remember someone mentioning a while back that they intended to use
> a pickup bed as the tank for a mixer, and in our discussion the
> question of possible problems with paper collecting in the corners
> came up. Has anyone actually made a mixer with a pickup bed as the
> tank? If so, please enlighten us.
>
>
>
> Also, Doris, your mixer is a cube. Any problems along those lines?
> Being cubical and smooth plastic I would think it might be better
> than a shallow bed, but I have been wrong many times in my life  : )
>
> --
> spaceman
>
> All opinions expressed or implied
> are subject to change without notice
> upon receipt of new information.
>





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Re: [papercreters] Re: Mixer Design



The first mixer I made had the axle welded directly to the frame, and that worked well. Later I switched to large "U" bolts around the axle and through the frame, which also works well. Emphasis on "large" and nice and tight. You might be able to find or fabricate a "spacer" between the frame and axle to help keep the axle from spinning, something like
 

[papercreters] Trash Pump Intake Hose ideas?

I've purchased a 3" trash pump for pumping my papercrete slurry and need to come up with a rigid intake hose for it.

I know that for sections of the about 15-foot intake hose that I can use 3" pvc. But it also needs flexible bends.

These need to be strong enough and rigid enough that they will not collapse during significant suction and will not puncture as slurry is pumped through the flexible portions.

Any ideas of inexpensive or reusable discarded materials that (along with hose clamps) could be used to manufacture the flexible portions of the intake hose? Would need to slide over 3" diameter pvc and clamp tightly to it.

Alternately, are you aware of any flexible, semi-rigid hoses or tubing material of 3" diameter that I could scavenge or re-purpose for the entire intake hose? I need the hose to be about 15 feet in length and to make several 90 to 180 degree bends.

Locally, 3-inch diameter semi-rigid intake-hose material made for trash pump (and water pump) use is selling for about $8 per foot.

(The stuff is advertised for 99 cents per foot on eBay, but they make up the difference with outrageous shipping/handling fees. It still comes out to somewhere north of $6 per foot.)

Would like to apply some ingeniuty -- yours and mine -- and beat that price and maybe, in the process, make good re-use of something that otherwise would be clogging a landfill.

Ideas?

Thanks,
ken

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[papercreters] Re: Mixer Design

Have been trying to locate a good, inexpensive source for those totes. They are what bulk corn syrup and bulk invert sugar and bulk maple syrup are shipped in to processed-food manufacturers and large-scale candy manufacturers (like Brachs, Stovers, Kraft, etc).

In the east and midwest -- where it appears most of the major candy manufacturers are located -- people report getting the totes for free (as discards) from factories for the asking and I find Craig's List ads back there where people are selling them for $50.

I was able to purchase one here (Santa Fe, New Mexico region) from a private party for $100 and so far have not found an industrial source for them. Would like to get three or four more -- for $50 each or less.

Anyone have any ideas?

And quick update on my own tow-behind mixer plans.

I bought a pickup-truck bed trailer and will be using the rear end and frame and trailer tongue from that for mine. MAY be using some of the pickup truck bed metal, too, for the platform.

Probably won't be building it for about two weeks as I just learned that my local dump transfer station is closing in a week for 60 days for reconstruction. And.... that is from where I was hoping to pull 5 tons of newsprint -- if the manager there is still game to let me. (She was a couple years ago.) So right now, I've shifted priorities to getting my flatbed trailer together to haul newsprint and seeing how much is available to pull from the transfer station before it closes.

For my tow mixer I MAY use one of the cube totes like Doris and Ron did. Or I may find a used usable round stock tank before I get to the building task.

Still not certain how I will attach the truck rear-end to the frame once I remove the leaf springs, but have some ideas.

-- ken

--- In papercreters@yahoogroups.com, michael joyce <mojojoyce@...> wrote:
>
> I am wondering about the same thing as far as I thought I saw a square plastic tank with the metal cage 275 gallon as a mixer.  This is by far  the cheapest tank that I can get around here. Michael
>
> --- On Tue, 8/23/11, Doris Burton <yakishome@...> wrote:
>
> From: Doris Burton <yakishome@...>
> Subject: Re: [papercreters] Mixer Design
> To: "papercreters@yahoogroups.com" <papercreters@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: Tuesday, August 23, 2011, 9:34 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> We mixed many batches and never seemed to have had any left in the cube, all paper mixed to an even consistency We did our entire project with it and never had any problems. Oh and it was not a small project.
> Doris
>
>
>
>
> From: Spaceman <Spaceman@...>
> To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
> Sent:
> Tuesday, August 23, 2011 5:13 PM
> Subject: [papercreters] Mixer Design
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I have been having an interesting discussion off list with Ken about
> mixer design.
>
>
>
> I remember someone mentioning a while back that they intended to use
> a pickup bed as the tank for a mixer, and in our discussion the
> question of possible problems with paper collecting in the corners
> came up. Has anyone actually made a mixer with a pickup bed as the
> tank? If so, please enlighten us.
>
>
>
> Also, Doris, your mixer is a cube. Any problems along those lines?
> Being cubical and smooth plastic I would think it might be better
> than a shallow bed, but I have been wrong many times in my life  : )
>
> --
> spaceman
>
> All opinions expressed or implied
> are subject to change without notice
> upon receipt of new information.
>


------------------------------------

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