Friday, February 27, 2015

Re: [papercreters] Fast alternative to papercrete?



Thankyou for that Marthe- i have been waiting months to use my papercrete pots! 

 cement chemistry is interesting and not necessarily intuitive. I love the Fairy garden stuff- beautiful!

On Mon, Feb 23, 2015 at 2:25 PM, Marthe Hook marthehook@hotmail.ca [papercreters] <papercreters@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

I' vw made many plnaters and pots formpaercrete and planted inthem within a week. NO problems. The newspaer does much to reduce alkalinity. Adding latex paint .a samll amount ..20z bottle for a small batch of crete for two pots. - helps with iresiliency as well as reducing alkalinity quickly.

Marthe   Website fairygarden.ca     DIY Blog   thefairygaren.ca   blog has a papercrete post

To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
From: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2015 16:06:16 -0600
Subject: Re: [papercreters] Fast alternative to papercrete?

 

Sorry I guess what I sent takes time to dry.

Find some blue plastic cattle lick tubs for free and use them till your pots dry.


Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone on the Verizon Wireless 4G LTE network.
From: gd@moworx.com [papercreters]
Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 11:59 AM
Subject: [papercreters] Fast alternative to papercrete?

 

Hi,

I am preparing to make a few garden pots from papercrete. I just realise for this time it takes too long until they cure. Could you recommend something similar that would be usable within a few days?







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Posted by: eo greensticks <eogreensticks@gmail.com>



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at 6:43 PM

[papercreters] Re: Making papercrete really waterproof



The matter of calcium chloride: CaCl is much more reactive than NaCl. Hence the the warning label. Its not explosive, but admixtures that would have neutral reactions in the presence of NaCl may not in the presence of CaCl. Probably the most common reaction would be precipitates.

Waterproofing: There are quite a few paints that would work quite well. The only problem being the cost. The other issue is papercrete to a certain extent needs to breathe. Sealing it up completely might lead to issues.

Planter pots: I use simple latex paint on the inside. You still might some alkaline bleed but it will be greatly reduced.




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Posted by: john mcginnis <maruadventurer@gmail.com>



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at 9:38 AM

Re: [papercreters] Making papercrete really waterproof



For timbercrete you use wood shavings instead of paper. In Australia they are building houses with timbercrete blocks.

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Posted by: gd@moworx.com



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at 2:54 AM

Re: [papercreters] Making papercrete really waterproof



Hi,

i don't know why the warning was there but it did say 'warning' as if it had something...that required a warning? The only thing i could think of was maybe the chloride might interact badly with a metal armature but that's a guess? sodium chloride in seawater is bane of ferrocement boatbuilding from what i have read- i am not a chemist so not sure about that one ( i did notice that in the US, potting soil has no warning where in Australia the warning on the bag makes me afraid to open the stuff! Maybe different rulebooks in different countries?)

cheers, eo

On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 3:29 PM, valledecalle@yahoo.com [papercreters] <papercreters@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

What is timbercrete?

Calle

Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone on the Verizon Wireless 4G LTE network.
From: gd@moworx.com [papercreters]
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 10:12 PM
Subject: Re: [papercreters] Making papercrete really waterproof

 

Hi Eo,
thanks for your information.

Most of the stuff is not available here in Europe but maybe I can have it shipped over

What does that mean:

"it does have a warning that it 'contains calcium chloride"

I use CaCl2 for timbercrete. Not sure if it would shorten the curing time for papercrete.

But I was not aware that we should be warned about it.

Cheers
S.





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Posted by: eo greensticks <eogreensticks@gmail.com>



__,_._,___

at 1:11 AM

Thursday, February 26, 2015

Re: [papercreters] Making papercrete really waterproof



What is timbercrete?

Calle

Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone on the Verizon Wireless 4G LTE network.
From: gd@moworx.com [papercreters]
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 10:12 PM
To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
Reply To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [papercreters] Making papercrete really waterproof

 

Hi Eo,
thanks for your information.

Most of the stuff is not available here in Europe but maybe I can have it shipped over

What does that mean:

"it does have a warning that it 'contains calcium chloride"

I use CaCl2 for timbercrete. Not sure if it would shorten the curing time for papercrete.

But I was not aware that we should be warned about it.

Cheers
S.




__._,_.___
Posted by: valledecalle@yahoo.com



__,_._,___

at 10:29 PM

Monday, February 23, 2015

[papercreters] Mason Greenstar blox recipe



Hi all,


Does anyone knows recipe of Mason Greenstar blox? I am really interesting to know mixture of cellulose and cement and other additives. What's in additives? please help me if someone knows it?




Thanks.

Tsogtoo




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Posted by: tsogtoo21@yahoo.com



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at 4:20 AM

Sunday, February 22, 2015

RE: [papercreters] Fast alternative to papercrete?



I' vw made many plnaters and pots formpaercrete and planted inthem within a week. NO problems. The newspaer does much to reduce alkalinity. Adding latex paint .a samll amount ..20z bottle for a small batch of crete for two pots. - helps with iresiliency as well as reducing alkalinity quickly.

Marthe   Website fairygarden.ca     DIY Blog   thefairygaren.ca   blog has a papercrete post

To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
From: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2015 16:06:16 -0600
Subject: Re: [papercreters] Fast alternative to papercrete?

 

Sorry I guess what I sent takes time to dry.

Find some blue plastic cattle lick tubs for free and use them till your pots dry.


Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone on the Verizon Wireless 4G LTE network.
From: gd@moworx.com [papercreters]
Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 11:59 AM
To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
Reply To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [papercreters] Fast alternative to papercrete?

 

Hi,

I am preparing to make a few garden pots from papercrete. I just realise for this time it takes too long until they cure. Could you recommend something similar that would be usable within a few days?






__._,_.___
Posted by: Marthe Hook <marthehook@hotmail.ca>



__,_._,___

at 9:25 PM

Re: [papercreters] Fast cure Plant pots



Thanks great ideas.
Calle

Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone on the Verizon Wireless 4G LTE network.
From: Charmaine Taylor charmainertaylor@gmail.com [papercreters]
Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2015 2:51 PM
To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
Reply To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [papercreters] Fast cure Plant pots

 

HI..if you are using cement powder or concrete mix in your 'crete the reason to do a LONG cure is  new made pots will 'burn' roots.  as crete cures in the rain, winter, etc it loses the harsh 'lye' type action.

see how it affects skin- then imagine seedlings in a new  pot after watering.
http://www.concreteconstruction.net/concrete-articles/avoiding-alkali-burns-from-fresh-mortar-or-concre.aspx
look up: Hypertufa posts- using peat moss, cement..same advice..must cure out the alkalies.

​the ideas to make the pot AROUND a hard plastic liner is good, and may solve the problem.​

I've made pots both ways…use a big plastic popcorn bowl, coat inside with oil..then pat in a sludgy crete to chap a 'bowl', let cure.

OR tune bowl over, use plastic bag, or none, and pat sludgy drier mix   to have a rougher  surface. and you can embedd shells, tiles, keys, artsy stuff..let cure and remove bowl..now has a smooth inside.

either way works.  for a really cheap easy NON removed  bowl shape use any straw basket- 5-25 cents at the thrift store- tons are tossed after a Tele-flora  type gift..pick anyshape, square, low trough etc.

​have fun​

--
Charmaine

Charmaine Taylor/Publishing & Elk River Press
PO Box 375 Cutten CA 95534
www.papercrete.com

 "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock."
― Thomas Jefferson 

 




__._,_.___
Posted by: valledecalle@yahoo.com



__,_._,___

at 3:41 PM

[papercreters] Fast cure Plant pots



HI..if you are using cement powder or concrete mix in your 'crete the reason to do a LONG cure is  new made pots will 'burn' roots.  as crete cures in the rain, winter, etc it loses the harsh 'lye' type action.

see how it affects skin- then imagine seedlings in a new  pot after watering.
http://www.concreteconstruction.net/concrete-articles/avoiding-alkali-burns-from-fresh-mortar-or-concre.aspx
look up: Hypertufa posts- using peat moss, cement..same advice..must cure out the alkalies.

​the ideas to make the pot AROUND a hard plastic liner is good, and may solve the problem.​

I've made pots both ways…use a big plastic popcorn bowl, coat inside with oil..then pat in a sludgy crete to chap a 'bowl', let cure.

OR tune bowl over, use plastic bag, or none, and pat sludgy drier mix   to have a rougher  surface. and you can embedd shells, tiles, keys, artsy stuff..let cure and remove bowl..now has a smooth inside.

either way works.  for a really cheap easy NON removed  bowl shape use any straw basket- 5-25 cents at the thrift store- tons are tossed after a Tele-flora  type gift..pick anyshape, square, low trough etc.

​have fun​

--
Charmaine

Charmaine Taylor/Publishing & Elk River Press
PO Box 375 Cutten CA 95534
www.papercrete.com

 "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock."
― Thomas Jefferson 

 


__._,_.___
Posted by: Charmaine Taylor <charmainertaylor@gmail.com>



__,_._,___

at 2:51 PM

[papercreters] Re: Fast alternative to papercrete?



I build papercrete pots by the hundreds and in the heat of the Summer I can build pots on Tuesday and sell them at the Farmer's Market on Saturday. I do have my paper soaked and pulped ahead of time. I use a 3 parts paper pulp, 2 parts portland cement, and 1 part perlite recipe. Most projects can be removed from the molds in 24 to 48 hours depending on size. Leave them in that same warm spot for two or three more days to cure and they should be useable. Read more about how I do it at The Papercrete Potter

 



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Posted by: hostas@classicnet.net



__,_._,___

at 11:42 AM

Saturday, February 21, 2015

[papercreters] Re: Fast alternative to papercrete?



SOMEONE put up a post a while ago saying they added acrylic  paint and sped up the cure phenomenally

but in addition to cure time, in a plant pot you need to consider alkalinity- maybe a plastic liner would solve that

tho i can't say from eexperience- the recommendation i keep finding is 

'leave it out in the rain for a year'. i put some pix of the plant pots i made on a post to this site.

P'crete makes great plantpots.

cheers, eo
'


__._,_.___
Posted by: eo greensticks <eogreensticks@gmail.com>



__,_._,___

at 4:40 PM

Re: [papercreters] Fast alternative to papercrete?



Sorry I guess what I sent takes time to dry.

Find some blue plastic cattle lick tubs for free and use them till your pots dry.


Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone on the Verizon Wireless 4G LTE network.
From: gd@moworx.com [papercreters]
Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 11:59 AM
To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
Reply To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [papercreters] Fast alternative to papercrete?

 

Hi,

I am preparing to make a few garden pots from papercrete. I just realise for this time it takes too long until they cure. Could you recommend something similar that would be usable within a few days?




__._,_.___
Posted by: valledecalle@yahoo.com



__,_._,___

at 4:06 PM

[papercreters] FYI....Pots with a Personal Touch: Hypertufa | Martha Stewart



Hope this helps.

Let us know how they come out.

http://www.marthastewart.com/268091/pots-with-a-personal-touch-hypertufa

Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone on the Verizon Wireless 4G LTE network.


__._,_.___
Posted by: valledecalle@yahoo.com



__,_._,___

at 4:06 PM

Re: [papercreters] Fast alternative to papercrete?



There is a terra Crete mixture that has been around a long time.
Google it from Martha Stewart. 
 

Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone on the Verizon Wireless 4G LTE network.
From: gd@moworx.com [papercreters]
Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 11:59 AM
To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
Reply To: papercreters@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [papercreters] Fast alternative to papercrete?

 

Hi,

I am preparing to make a few garden pots from papercrete. I just realise for this time it takes too long until they cure. Could you recommend something similar that would be usable within a few days?




__._,_.___
Posted by: valledecalle@yahoo.com



__,_._,___

at 4:06 PM

Friday, February 20, 2015

[papercreters] Fast alternative to papercrete?



Hi,

I am preparing to make a few garden pots from papercrete. I just realise for this time it takes too long until they cure. Could you recommend something similar that would be usable within a few days?



__._,_.___
Posted by: gd@moworx.com



__,_._,___

at 3:14 AM

Sunday, February 15, 2015

Re: [papercreters] Making papercrete really waterproof



Hi Eo,
thanks for your information.

Most of the stuff is not available here in Europe but maybe I can have it shipped over

What does that mean:

"it does have a warning that it 'contains calcium chloride"

I use CaCl2 for timbercrete. Not sure if it would shorten the curing time for papercrete.

But I was not aware that we should be warned about it.

Cheers
S.

__._,_.___
Posted by: gd@moworx.com



__,_._,___

at 3:15 PM

Saturday, February 14, 2015

Re: [papercreters] Making papercrete really waterproof



Hi, 
 i use a papercrete topcoat on my ferrocement sculptures and have experimented a little with waterproofing the finished sculptures- two things i have tried successfully were:

crommelin  waterproofing natural finish penetrating sealer- seemed to do the job but was smelly and needed solvent cleanup which i wasn't keen on but it says it's waterproofing compounds are taken below the surface hence 'penetrating'
and
sure seal aerosol tile and grout sealer which is technically for mosaic work (voted best in industry according to the can) I wasn't too happy about the can but it didn't require a toxic solvent clean-up episode. It wouldn't be any chop for large areas due to the size of the can.

I don't yet know if they would require recoating at some time-  a basement is on a considerably different scale compared to a sculpture. 

Bill Birdsall did some roofs and i think tunnels using 'nylon cement' in Puerto Rico- it was fishing net and portland slurry-http://www.naturalbuildingblog.com/nylon-cement-roofs/ this link is about roofs but i am sure he did some under ground level tunnels, too- maybe a hybrid approach would work? 

I keep returning to the idea of using magnesium phosphate cement in place of portland in the papercrete which i have not been able to test as i haven't been able to source the materials but in the US you can buy  grancrete which as i understand is the stuff all mixed up and ready to go- as it makes a chemically bonded ceramic which is impervious to water down to 10 microns from memory, in theory it would produce a waterproof papercrete. If you google Michael Collins, an artist who lives in Mexico, he has done some interesting work with magphos cement.

The other thing i plan to try out is Silasec waterproofer by Bondall- it doesn't seem to be a penetrating sealer but has recipes on the container for waterproof paint and putty- says it will seal fishponds and tanks, resists water pressure, etc ( it does have a warning that it 'contains calcium chloride') I wanted to extend the 'waterproof putty' idea but haven't tried it out yet. Maybe as an ingredient in portland slurry over fishnet with a acrylic/papercrete render?

cheers, eo


__._,_.___
Posted by: eo greensticks <eogreensticks@gmail.com>



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at 12:23 AM

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